Check out my post below detailing my proposal for another extension to the GIVfarm (August 5th, 2022)
Original Post
Hey everyone! So we’re lagging a bit behind on our core roadmap and we’ve gotten caught up in all sorts of new opportunities. New opportunities are great and have lead to all sorts of exciting avenues for the Future of Giving. However I have to raise a concern that our Liquidity Mining (LM) Program may end before we have a thriving solution for GIV token utility and strong GIV liquidity that could survive the hit that comes when we end our LM program. Currently this is set to end around the 25th of June.
@amin I’m curious to know what the extra effort would be to break this down a little? If we decided to extend for 2 months and then set up another 2 months… would that be much more work?
I think 4 months past end of June is perhaps more than we need, and it’s nice to be a little more modular.
If we want to split it, it will not be a big deal and much work! Everything we do for the first can be repeated with simple changes.
Part of extending farms is assigning more balance for LMs on tokendistro, and it can be done by multisig! We can assign balances needed for both rounds once in order to make less transactions.
+1 on the extension, and on adding GIV/xDAI yesss please - this will make buying GIV on Gnosis Chain more effective I think, based on the feedback I receive from people trying to buy it for farming.
Though we probably need to be gentle on that to not impact HNY adversely?
Univ3 contracts are not deployed on gnosis chain based on my knowledge. Nevertheless, the uniswap v3 staking has a characteristic of rewarding only in range liquidity which made us terminate ours univ3 staking program on mainnet
Univ3 is a degen’s game… rewards go disproportionately to those who are focused on managing positions often with focused effort. Univ2-esque systems are just more fair to broadly reward liquidity proportionately to the amount provided.
We learned that already, no need to dive down that rabbit hole again. Univ3 liquidity via the angel vault seems much more attractive. For the rest of the GIVfarm, let’s keep it simple.
We make a 2 months extension to the GIVfarm, retiring the GIV/HNY farm in favour of a GIV/xDAI farm. With a possible additonal 2 months that can be added, we will asses the situation around end of July 2022 and see if we need another extension.
GIV per week = 600k (flat distribution)
Number of weeks = 8 (with a possible 8 week extension)
Total GIV distributed = 4.8 Milion (9.6 Million with extension)
Also I hope we make sure that in the documentation that we mention we might kill the farms at any time. I think we are on a nice run with token swaps for liquidity, and GIVpower could start during that time… so we for sure want to mention that our Governance can turn off the rewards.
Currently the GIVfarm documentation has this footnote:
Note that, as a result of the termination of the Univ3 rewards program in week 13 there is approximately 5M GIV, previously earmarked for these rewards, that are no longer part of the GIVfarm allocation.
Further rounds may be launched after this period that could contain new pools and changes in distribution. All rewards from GIVfarm will be affected by the GIVstream. Read up on the GIVstream documentation for more information.
So are we really extending the round or are we launching a new round?
If
Then it would make sense to launch a new round that is a “maximum of X weeks or may terminate sooner based on Y and Z factors”, for example.
Hey everyone, I remember @Cotabe mentioned a few weeks ago that our current GIVfarm rewards will be running out soon. With all of our cool new products I think we lost the thread on this one. FYI… Most GIVfarms are set to end on August 19th
Now is the time to tackle the question of if we are extending GIVfarm rewards for any programs outside of GIVpower and the Angel Vault, which already have their rewards approved for the next 6 months.
The farms currently on the chopping block (when rewards end) are:
GIV on Mainnet
GIV/ETH on Balancer
GIV/WETH on Sushiswap
GIV/DAI on Uniswap v2
GIV/ xDAI on Honeyswap
Here’s a quick refresher on the parameters from our last extension:
The first GIVfarm Extension happened on June 24th, 2022. The farm was extended a further 8 weeks with an additional 4 Million GIV allocated to farming rewards.
A flat 500,000 GIV is distributed weekly from June 24th until August 19th 2022
Here is a breakdown of the farms, the percentage allocated to each and the flat amount of GIV distributed weekly:
Farm
% Allocated
GIV Per Week
GIV/DAI Uniswap V2 on Mainnet
23%
115,000
80GIV/ETH Balancer on Mainnet
15%
75,000
GIV Staking on Mainnet
5%
25,000
50GIV/xDAI Honeyswap on xDai
25%
125,000
50GIV/WETH Sushiswap on xDai
17%
85,000
GIVgardens/staking on xDai
15%
75,000
I do acknowledge that all goods things must come to an end and we can look to the horizon for some initiatives that might be a great boon for our DAO owned liquidity such as:
I would like to propose however a 3 month extension for the following farms:
GIV/ETH on Balancer
GIV/WETH on Sushiswap
Extending them from August 19th for 12 weeks precisely, taking us to November 11th, 2022 and to distribute a total of 1,680,000 GIV in rewards. I would propose this weekly distribution:
Farm
% Allocated
GIV Per Week
80GIV/ETH Balancer on Mainnet
57%
80,000
50GIV/WETH Sushiswap on xDai
43%
60,000
Total Weekly
140,000
I think these ETH farms are a very important incentive to capture the potential upside of ETH and the inevitable growth of crypto and the Ethereum ecosystem. In particular the GIV/ETH Balancer pool will allow liquidity providers in the Angel Vault a place they can directly deposit their GIV on Mainnet that they receive from the rebalancing effects of the program.
Good point! We could, as a safety net allocate 4 weeks of rewards to the GIVgardens staking at current rates which is 75k GIV per week. This comes to 300k GIV and would last until September 16th.
We should also verify that in fact we can pause these rewards once GIVpower is launched. Maybe that’s a question for yourself or @amin ?
Hey @mitch - thank you so much for pushing this forward, you are our hero in so many ways! I have a few thoughts:
Balancer Mainnet - Can we be a bit more conservative?
We have limited mainnet liquidity for GIV, and while the Angel Vault is great, it is a bit of a challenge in terms of onboarding new users. We should focus on mainnet DAO2DAO liquidity in the next months, but in the meantime, I agree with extending the balancer rewards. Although, I think we can be a little more conservative in the allocation.
We are maintaining around 200% APR for $100k of liquidiity right now on Balancer. So we’re paying about $16k for $100k of liquidity every 4 weeks. That is a lot of money for relatively low liquidity. I think we can get away with decreasing the weekly allocation - say perhaps by 25%… bringing the APR down to about 150% assuming people do not withdraw liquidity.
I don’t think think 200% vs. 150% APR on this pool will create a huge impact on the liquidity added and will save the DAO some GIV.
The biggest pool for GIV is GIV < > GNO w/ over $700k of liquidty on honeyswap.
The biggest pool for GNO is GNO < > WETH w/ over $2M of liquidity on honeyswap
Your proposal is suggesting to put out about 60,000 GIV/week to maintain Sushiswap liquidity, which at current prices is about $12k every 4 weeks to maintain $126k of extra liquidity w/ WETH.
I just don’t think that it’s really necessary because of our huge liqudity with GNO & their pool with WETH - we could save the extra $36k here by ending this farm, at (imo) no huge disadvantage to the economy.
GIV Staking - An addition
As I mentioned in the governance call, it is unfortunately unlikely that GIVpower staking will be ready to launch before August 19. We are in the process of reviewing the contracts, and it has become apparent that we need more time to ensure they are safe, tested & ready to go. We have allocated 7M GIV for GIVpower for 6 months… and I think we should reserve that until we actually launch it.
Therefore, I would like to additionally propose that we extend 100% GIV staking on Gnosis Chain for a maximum of 8 weeks (likely to terminate earlier with the launch of GIVpower) to ensure that GIVfarmers still have somewhere to part their harvested GIV rewards.
I am suggesting that we terminate mainnet GIV staking and implement our new “bridge your GIV to Gnosis Chain to stake them” user flow, and then people can start getting used to that flow even before GIVpower staking is out (ETA early September).
Since there is over 16M GIV being staked right now on Gnosis Chain, the APRs are relatively low (24% today). If we want to bring people over to gnosis to stake their GIV, and prevent them from dumping their harvested rewards, I think we should up this a little.
Conclusion
I am proposing some adjustment’s to Mitch’s suggestion above, as follows:
Farm
GIV Per Week
Weeks to Run
80GIV/ETH Balancer on Mainnet
60,000
12
100% GIV staking on Gnosis Chain
100,000
< 8
Total Weekly
160,000
And I think we should run the Balancer pool for 12 weeks (as originally proposed)… but will not run the GIV staking that long… an absolutely maximum of 8 weeks, to be replaced by GIVpower when it launches. So this would be a maximum total of 1,520,000 in GIV.
Note: I am also curious to know if anyone thinks we should temporarily also extend mainnet GIV staking. We could do 75,000/week for Gnosis staking + 25,000/week for mainnet staking & just stay the course without current allocations.
GIVpower will be an upgrade to our current Gnosis Chain 100% GIV staking contract… it will actually be the same contract, only better. It will be like a transformation of the GIV staking pool into the GIVpower pool (and people won’t even need to unstake / restake their GIV).
So we won’t need to pause the rewards, we will just need to adjust the amount of GIV per week going out. I don’t think this is much of a problem, but will let @amin confirm.
Cool thanks for the nice cost breakdown! I’m down to give a bit less on the Balancer Pool 60k per week is good.
I think we can also end GIV staking on mainnet and direct people to deposit their GIV into the Balancer Pool.
Gnosis Chain
I would point out that in addition to ending the Sushiswap Pool we will also end the GIV/xDAI pool which holds around $64k in xDAI so ending both those farms with no other option besides GIVpower (or just the GIVgarden potentially) puts ~$190k of liquidity potentially on the chopping block.
If we lower weekly emissions of GIV/WETH on Sushiswap to 40k GIV a week that brings our USD value of emissions per 4 weeks to $8k, across a whole 3 month program this equals $24k.
I would also point out there is some external factors, particularly the upcoming merge, which by incentivizing ETH liquidity we could see some of the upside around the current hype.
Praise @mitch and @karmaticacid for such great proposals and well-thought arguments to figure out the continuation of the GIVfarms. I think the interaction is helping find the best solution.
I think these are important considerations…
As well as, how it can be convenient to direct people to single stacking so they are already there once that farm is upgraded to GIVpower.
Maybe we can harness the upside of the Merge while and softening the fall of the liquidity by starting from a 80,000 GIV per week and reduce 10,000 GIV every week. By mid October we could close that farm and the average cost would have been 40k GIV a week for 2 months, this equals $16k.
I am also concerned about ending the GIV stacking farm on mainnet on the first cycles of the Jagged Staircase while a lot of key people are preparing for burning man. So I would support this:
for the next 6 weeks while 2 cycles pass and all the team is in full swing or at least for 2 weeks to have more info on what happened after the rewards dumped.
Most GIVfarms are set to end on August 19th